-> CHI E' IL NUOVO MINISTRO DEGLI ESTERI DELLA RFJ?
Goran Svilanovic, l'uomo che ha invitato il Tribunale dell'Aia a
Belgrado
-> INTERVISTA ALL'EX MINISTRO DEGLI ESTERI DELLA RFJ
Zivadin Jovanovic, 17/10/2000
Versione in inglese; l'intervista in lingua originale francese e'
leggibile su:
http://www.egroups.com/message/crj-mailinglist/532
(Precedenti interviste ad es. su:
http://www.egroups.com/message/crj-mailinglist/384
http://www.egroups.com/message/crj-mailinglist/362)
---
The URL for this article is http://emperors-clothes.com/news/goran.htm
www.tenc.net
[Emperor's Clothes]
Who is Goran Svilanovic?
The Man Who Invited The War Crimes Tribunal to Belgrade
by Jared Israel (11-7-2000)
Goran Svilanovic became Foreign Minister of Yugoslavia last weekend.
Exactly how Svilanovic achieved this post without a
vote of the Yugoslav Parliament is a mystery, but in his newly acquired
post, Svilanovic just announced, with the apparent
approval of Vojislav Kostunica, who has taken the post of President,
that the International Criminal Tribunal for the Former
Yugoslavia (the 'War Crimes Tribunal') will establish an office in
Belgrade and that 'his' government will fully cooperate in
hunting down 'war criminals.'
This represents a reversal of Yugoslav policy. That policy was
established by a government with a majority of seats in the
Federal Parliament. It does not appear that Parliament has discussed
this change; it has simply been announced.
Goran Svilanovic is Chairperson of the miniscule Serbian Citizens'
Alliance party (GSS). He ascended to that position in
August, 1999. The GSS has had the warmest relations with Washington. Its
previous chair, Vesna Pesic, was a founder of the
Washington-funded group, 'Women in Black,' which simulated the
appearance of a peace movement while actively
discouraging resistance to the Washington/Bonn assault on Yugoslavia.
Pesic is widely despised in Yugoslavia as a traitor.
Another former GSS leader (he is now with the minute Social Democratic
Union) Zarko Korac, a Belgrade psych professor,
has appeared in Western mass media as an expert witness, arguing his pet
theory, that the Yugoslav wars of secession were
caused by Serbian aggression stemming from paranoia, the much acclaimed
'victim mentality.'
Mr. Svilanovic met several times with US Special Envoy to the Balkans,
Robert Gelbard; for instance on August 4, 1999.
('Middle East News Items,' August 10, 1999 )
On Nov. 3. 1999 Svilanovic and other opposition leaders met in
Washington with Madeline Albright who promised them more
money and other support and praised their courage, etc. Following is the
text of Svilanovic's statement made at that time, from
Washington, D.C.:
Text of Svilanovic's statement, broadcast on Radio B2-92, Belgrade,
1600 gmt 4 Nov 99:
"Announcer: The chairman of the Serbian Civic Alliance GSS - member
of the Alliance for Change , Goran Svilanovic,
has joined his party's news conference from Washington by phone and
said that the main achievement of meetings in
Washington is the announcement that a joint working group of the US,
the EU [European Union] and the Serbian
opposition representatives will be set up.
"Svilanovic: They see this working group here as a trilateral
commission. The US has publicly said that it wishes, in
conjunction with the EU, to establish a committee which would
cooperate with a democratic Serbia in the process of
democratic reforms in the country. The idea that the EU and the USA
want and wish to work together and to define a
joint policy regarding Serbia is, as far as I am concerned, the main
achievement of all these meetings."
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[Emperor's Clothes]
---
Published this 17th of October in Solidaire - Belgium
ZIVADIN JOVANOVIC - INTERVIEW
AN EXCLUSIVE INTERVIEW WITH ZIVADIN JOVANOVIC, YUGOSLAV MINISTER OF
FOREIGN
AFFAIRS
"For every dollar that the West "gives" to Yugoslavia, it must have ten
in
return!"
Last week, Solidaire interviewed two Otpor activists, the anti-Milosevic
student movement. Today, it is Zivadin Jovanovic, Yugoslav Foreign
Affairs
Minister, and also one of the most important leaders in Milosevic's SPS
party. This party, having held onto its share of the electorate,
remains
the most important political party in the country. In these troubled
days,
hundreds of international journalists have sought to interview a
socialist
leader. The honor went to Solidaire's special correspondent.
MICHEL COLLON
Tuesday, October 11, 11:30 a.m. I entered the grand oval office of
Zivadin
Jovanovic, Minister of Foreign Affairs. It is probably one of the last
times that he will be found here. Some people say that it's "the end of
a
reign." "An eclips before a likely return," answer those who emphasize
the
fact that with 40% of the electorate (a fixed number), the SPS
(Milosevic's
socialist party) remains the most important party in the country, while
the
present DOS coalition is quite fragile: 18 parties whose programs
contradict one another, and whose electoral promises will be impossible
to
fulfil. Jovanovic, who is quite jovial and quick to smile, also has a
number of questions to ask himself. The impassioned interview lasted
three
hours.
How are you?
Jovanovic: I'm surviving! In spite of a very unpleasant visit paid to
my
this morning by a troika from the DOS, who came to try to force me to
step
down. Claiming to be "from President Kostunica," they are going
everywhere
putting pressure on people who have legal mandates in order to force
them to
leave. I responded that Mr. Kostunica had just sworn allegiance to the
Constitution and, after that, I called to their attention that it is not
the
president but the Prime Minister who names ministers. In public, they
claim
to respect the law and the normal functioning of institutions, but in
reality, they are doing everything in their power to destroy them! They
are
trying to create chaos.
The DOS declares that it is "the workers who are taking control of
factories."
Jovanovic: But when this country practiced "self-management of
companies by
workers," the said that it was a form of Communist dictatorship. In
reality, today, it is Zoran Djindjic, the executive head of DOS
headquarters
and I might add its true master (Editor's note: Djindjic is a
politician
from the right who is extremely unpopular for having supported Nato),
who is
in a hurry to seize everything. They are stampeding like hungry
jackals.
These politicians are not the people. They want to seize power of
everything right away in order to start selling off the country.
One could see on television the Customs Chief chased out of his office
and
replaced, under the threat of arms by a certain "Captian Dragan," who is
the
leader of a Serbian militia that was active during the war in Croatia.
This
was a scene that shook public opinion.
Jovanovic: The man whom Djindjic placed as Customs Chief had been in
charge
of customs before. He was fired because he had a police record. Now,
he
comes back with armed supporters and takes his old job back! Is this a
"spontaneous movement that arose from the masses?" People were so
infuriated that the DOS realized that it was an illegal act and that
they
would have to nominate a new director. On the basis of what law? It is
not
within their power to do so because the nomination of a new director is
within the jurisdiction the current government, which is still in
office.
Little by little, the people are going to understand. Even the DOS.
There
are honest people who disapprove. But they lost, and without any
influence.
President Kostunica whose reputation is impeccable, ought to be
concerned
about this. In Parliament, he took an oath of loyalty to the
Constitution.
These people are scoffing at it now.
But for the moment, most of the population is very happy about the
"change."
Jovanovic: They will understand what took place when they find
themselves
without a job, when they see the stores filled with Western products
that
they will be impossible for them to buy, when they submit to a system
where
they can be arbitrarily deprived of jobs, and when they have to pay
enormous
sums of money for education and health care. That's when they'll
understand.
I know that our stores are not very impressive. There are few German,
French or English products. But most of the people can buy whatever
they
need, even modern domestic appliances. It will be a rude awakening.
People
cannot dream very long about miraculous solutions.
The West promises to provide Yugoslavia with financial aid.
Jovanovic: A little money will come from Europe, and the DOS will
present
it as "aid from friendly countries." In reality, it will be a down
payment
on the purchase of our entire country. For every dollar received, we
will
be obliged to pay back ten!
In fact, dollars have already found their way into Yugoslavia.
Jovanovic: Yes, the United States publicly acknowledged having spent
$77.2
million dollars in order to help the opposition overturn the Yugoslav
government. And on September 25, the U.S. Congress voted a new credit
of
$105 million dollars.
Have you lodged a protest with the UN against this interference in
elections?
Jovanovic: Of course. This destabilization of our country was
organized
first in Budapest, with American offices established in Sofia, Skoplje
and
elsewhere, and composed of CIA agents. The Vienna Accords forbid
establishing centers in one country that are hostile to another. Look
at
what's happening today. The American ambassador to Budapest,
Montgomery, is
coming to Yugoslavia to pay a visit to his subordinates at the DOS!
But the United States and Great Britain, who control the UN, have denied
all
evidence of this. Other countries understand what's happening here, but
we
can't even get a debate.
The United States has spent considerable sums of money for the DOS
electoral
campaign.
Jovanovic: Yes. And how would they react if this sort of thing was
done in
the United States? It reminds me of a joke that's told here: a
villager
sees a priest eating a huge serving of roast beef in the middle of a
religious fast. "But you told us that fasting was a one of God's
commandments!" says the villager. The priest replies: "You're supposed
to
obey my instructions, but you're not supposed to act the way I do!"
In short, "do as I say, not as I do."
Jovanovic: (Laughing) Yes! That's exactly the case with the United
States!
What they permit themselves to do, they forbid to others. Whenever they
speak of "democracy," it's merely a slogan they advance in order to
dominate
the world. Another example: they want to impose an International War
Crimes tribunal in order to put us on trial. But they themselves refuse
to
accept a universal war crimes tribunal, which would put them on trial
for
all of the war crimes they committed against various sovereign states.
They
know all too well that they would be convicted for what they have done
in
Panama, Haiti and elsewhere!
In 1995, in the Assembly General of the United Nations, they voted
against a
resolution which forbade intervention in the domestic affairs,
particularly
electoral, of other countries. This resolution was voted in despite
American opposition, so they ought to follow the rules of the democratic
majority! "Two weights, two measures," that's the key to American-style
"democracy."
Is Yugoslavia lone targeted, or does this announce other offensives by
the
United States and Nato?
Jovanovic: It is not merely the problem of one country in a strategic
region. They are going to make a terrific effort because if Yugoslav
resistance lasted much longer, it would have become a dangerous
example. We
were in the process of acquiring growing support from the Third World.
Is Russia the next step?
Jovanovic: If so much energy has been concentrated against Yugoslavia,
then
it is not merely to gratify the immediate interests of the United States
and
Nato in our country. In order to understand, it is necessary to take
into
consideration their global aspirations. Besides certain regions which
have
a vital importance in and of themselves, because of their significant
natural resources, whatever Nato and the United States are doing is
always a
function of their global interests.
First of all, they want to destroy any will to independence and
resistance
to their domination of the entire world. Secondly, they want to send
the
message that "No country at all is allowed to invoke principles; it must
only respect the way the United States sees things. Thirdly, Nato is
thus
drawing closer to the borders of Russia and China. Washington is
working
toward breaking them up while planting the seeds of separatism and
manipulating Islamic fundamentalism. On the one hand, they are
deceiving
the Muslims in making them believe that they are their friends.
All of this while they are massacring people in Irak and Palestine.
Jovanovic: Exactly! And on the other hand, they are looking for a way
to
control mineral and energy resources in the same way they want to
control
the new markets which are opening up to the east of our country: the
Caucasus, the Middle East... Having established their control over
western
Europe, the United States now wants to control all the governments of
Eurasia. That is the decisive global factor involved.
In having resisted for ten years, we have given other countries time.
Some
countries have been awakened to their role with respect to the
situation,
but it has not been enough. Without a doubt (there was a melancholy
note in
his voice), the burden Yugoslavia had to carry was too heavy. We have
received some support, but not enough, most notably from countries that
we
were counting on.
Are you thinking of Russia?
Jovanovic: (He did not reply, but merely nodded his head). Nothing is
forever. Including the present situation in Yugoslavia. I am certain
that,
just as certain people who voted for the DOS are going to regret it,
certain
European countries will regret not having supported Yugoslavia more and
they
have come to that realization too late.
(Smiling again) An old Serbian song says: "The bear is dancing on your
uncle's doorstep. And now, he's coming to your house!" In other words:
You haven't budged, but you will regret it. Everybody has
underestimated
these events and they have not seen the risk that they have taken by not
reacting.
And from your point of view, do you think you've made some mistakes?
Jovanovic: Yes. I don't want to evade any of our responsibilities. We
did
not realistically evaluate the domestic and international situations.
We
did not take into consideration the negative factors.
For example?
Jovanovic: Domesticly, we did not realistically consider the sentiments
of
the people. We should have paid closer attention to the effects of the
deprivations which the people were subjected to after ten years of
sanctions. The people resisted aggression; they resisted sanctions, but
their living conditions were really degraded beyond any reasonable
point.
And with the war on top of it all!
Secondly, after the aggression, we put a great deal of effort into
reconstructing the country. Schools, hospitals, roads, bridges... This
demanded a lot of capital and we had to levy an assessment on salaries
and
pensions. The reconstruction was important for the future of the
country,
but it did not directly improve the quality of life. We should have
been
more realistic as far as investments were concerned, and adopted further
measures to improving the living condition of the people.
Thirdly, we did not succeed in controlling commerce. We gave too much
latitude to greedy people who stockpiled merchandise, like oil and
sugar,
which resulted in prices increases before the market was resupplied.
People
profited from the situation to stockpile and speculate. They sometimes
sold
items at two or three times their cost! Imagine the fortunes they
accumulated!
There is a cement factory in my region called Paracim. It's a very
important product because there was a lot of reconstruction to do after
the
bombardment. During an election rally, a woman came up to me: "Mr.
Minister, why do you let these people charge 13 deutschemarks for a sack
of
cement when it only costs 3.5 deutschemarks when it leaves the factory?"
The director of the factory was standing right next to me, so I turned
to
him, and he said: "I am only responsible for the production. I can't
control commerce." I talked about this situation with my colleagues
from
the economics department. But too late.
Many have criticized your government as well as your party for the fact
that
while the great majority of people were living under conditions of
extreme
difficulty, fantastic fortunes were also being made. Some people lived
lives of luxury and privilege.
Jovanovic: Some people profited from their position in order to
illegally
and immorally enrich themselves. Now we are suffering the consequences.
But they represent a minority. The great majority of our socialists are
honest people who struggle for social justice, education and health-care
for
all.
Why didn't you fight more vigorously against this phenomenon? Because
what
you are describing is not a recent development.
Jovanovic: The forces at the heart of my party were not inclined to
undertake this struggle. But now, we are going to have to get rid of
these
profiteers. Efficiently and pitilessly.
At all levels?
At all levels.
Many people think that Milosevic would have done better to recognize
Kostunica's victory immediately.
Jovanovic: I don't know if Kostunica had 51%, 50% of the vote or
somewhat
less, and now I don't care. Anyway one looks at it, it is clear that he
had
a 10% lead over Milosevic and that he was going to win. On the other
hand,
there is a legal process that must be respected. They should have
verified
that he really got 50% or if a second round was necessary.
In fact, isn't the DOS victory the result of a number of factors?
Jovanovic: Absolutely. The principal-for which we are to blame, and I
myself am to blame-is that we severely misjudged the real situation.
Even
though I had achieved good results with my constituency in Pomoravije,
winning three districts out of six. Maybe four after verification.
In fact, the SPS is holding on to its electorate.
Jovanovic: Yes, but this is what is new. Washington has succeeded in
making the opposition DOS credible. Faced with this great international
campaign, financed by millions of dollars, we can be satisfied to have
succeeded in conserving the SPS's force. Too bad that we did not
succeed in
enlarging our base. That will be our task in the future.
Translated by Milo Yelesiyevich
Michel Collon
ZIVADIN JOVANOVIC - INTERVIEWAN EXCLUSIVE INTERVIEW WITH ZIVADIN
JOVANOVIC, YUGOSLAV MINISTER OF FOREIGN
AFFAIRS
"For every dollar that the West "gives" to Yugoslavia, it must have ten
in return!"
Last week, Solidaire interviewed two Otpor activists, the anti-Milosevic
student movement. Today, it is Zivadin Jovanovic, Yugoslav Foreign
Affairs Minister, and also one of the most important leaders in
Milosevic's SPS party. This party, having held onto its share of the
electorate, remains the most important political party in the country.
In these troubled days, hundreds of international journalists have
sought to interview a socialist leader. The honor went to Solidaire's
special correspondent.
MICHEL COLLON
Tuesday, October 11, 11:30 a.m. I entered the grand oval office of
Zivadin Jovanovic, Minister of Foreign Affairs. It is probably one of
the last times that he will be found here. Some people say that it's
"the end of a reign." "An eclips before a likely return," answer those
who emphasize the fact that with 40% of the electorate (a fixed number),
the SPS (Milosevic's socialist party) remains the most important party
in the country, while the present DOS coalition is quite fragile: 18
parties whose programs contradict one another, and whose electoral
promises will be impossible to fulfil. Jovanovic, who is quite jovial
and quick to smile, also has a number of questions to ask himself. The
impassioned interview lasted three hours.
How are you?
Jovanovic: I'm surviving! In spite of a very unpleasant visit paid to
my this morning by a troika from the DOS, who came to try to force me to
step down. Claiming to be "from President Kostunica," they are going
everywhere putting pressure on people who have legal mandates in order
to force them to leave. I responded that Mr. Kostunica had just sworn
allegiance to the Constitution and, after that, I called to their
attention that it is not the president but the Prime Minister who names
ministers. In public, they claim to respect the law and the normal
functioning of institutions, but in reality, they are doing everything
in their power to destroy them! They are trying to create chaos.
The DOS declares that it is "the workers who are taking control of
factories."
Jovanovic: But when this country practiced "self-management of
companies by workers," the said that it was a form of Communist
dictatorship. In reality, today, it is Zoran Djindjic, the executive
head of DOS headquarters and I might add its true master (Editor's
note: Djindjic is a politician from the right who is extremely
unpopular for having supported Nato), who is in a hurry to seize
everything. They are stampeding like hungry jackals. These politicians
are not the people. They want to seize power of everything right away
in order to start selling off the country.
One could see on television the Customs Chief chased out of his office
and replaced, under the threat of arms by a certain "Captian Dragan,"
who is the leader of a Serbian militia that was active during the war in
Croatia. This was a scene that shook public opinion.
Jovanovic: The man whom Djindjic placed as Customs Chief had been in
charge of customs before. He was fired because he had a police record.
Now, he comes back with armed supporters and takes his old job back! Is
this a "spontaneous movement that arose from the masses?" People were
so infuriated that the DOS realized that it was an illegal act and that
they would have to nominate a new director. On the basis of what law?
It is not within their power to do so because the nomination of a new
director is within the jurisdiction the current government, which is
still in office.
Little by little, the people are going to understand. Even the DOS.
There are honest people who disapprove. But they lost, and without any
influence. President Kostunica whose reputation is impeccable, ought to
be concerned about this. In Parliament, he took an oath of loyalty to
the Constitution. These people are scoffing at it now.
But for the moment, most of the population is very happy about the
"change."
Jovanovic: They will understand what took place when they find
themselves without a job, when they see the stores filled with Western
products that they will be impossible for them to buy, when they submit
to a system where they can be arbitrarily deprived of jobs, and when
they have to pay enormous sums of money for education and health care.
That's when they'll understand.
I know that our stores are not very impressive. There are few German,
French or English products. But most of the people can buy whatever
they need, even modern domestic appliances. It will be a rude
awakening. People cannot dream very long about miraculous solutions.
The West promises to provide Yugoslavia with financial aid.
Jovanovic: A little money will come from Europe, and the DOS will
present it as "aid from friendly countries." In reality, it will be a
down payment on the purchase of our entire country. For every dollar
received, we will be obliged to pay back ten!
In fact, dollars have already found their way into Yugoslavia.
Jovanovic: Yes, the United States publicly acknowledged having spent
$77.2 million dollars in order to help the opposition overturn the
Yugoslav government. And on September 25, the U.S. Congress voted a new
credit of $105 million dollars.
Have you lodged a protest with the UN against this interference in
elections?
Jovanovic: Of course. This destabilization of our country was
organized first in Budapest, with American offices established in Sofia,
Skoplje and elsewhere, and composed of CIA agents. The Vienna Accords
forbid establishing centers in one country that are hostile to another.
Look at what's happening today. The American ambassador to Budapest,
Montgomery, is coming to Yugoslavia to pay a visit to his subordinates
at the DOS!
But the United States and Great Britain, who control the UN, have denied
all evidence of this. Other countries understand what's happening here,
but we can't even get a debate.
The United States has spent considerable sums of money for the DOS
electoral campaign.
Jovanovic: Yes. And how would they react if this sort of thing was
done in the United States? It reminds me of a joke that's told here: a
villager sees a priest eating a huge serving of roast beef in the middle
of a religious fast. "But you told us that fasting was a one of God's
commandments!" says the villager. The priest replies: "You're supposed
to obey my instructions, but you're not supposed to act the way I do!"
In short, "do as I say, not as I do."
Jovanovic: (Laughing) Yes! That's exactly the case with the United
States! What they permit themselves to do, they forbid to others.
Whenever they speak of "democracy," it's merely a slogan they advance in
order to dominate the world. Another example: they want to impose an
International War Crimes tribunal in order to put us on trial. But they
themselves refuse to accept a universal war crimes tribunal, which would
put them on trial for all of the war crimes they committed against
various sovereign states. They know all too well that they would be
convicted for what they have done in Panama, Haiti and elsewhere!
In 1995, in the Assembly General of the United Nations, they voted
against a resolution which forbade intervention in the domestic affairs,
particularly electoral, of other countries. This resolution was voted
in despite American opposition, so they ought to follow the rules of the
democratic majority! "Two weights, two measures," that's the key to
American-style "democracy."
Is Yugoslavia lone targeted, or does this announce other offensives by
the United States and Nato?
Jovanovic: It is not merely the problem of one country in a strategic
region. They are going to make a terrific effort because if Yugoslav
resistance lasted much longer, it would have become a dangerous
example. We were in the process of acquiring growing support from the
Third World.
Is Russia the next step?
Jovanovic: If so much energy has been concentrated against Yugoslavia,
then it is not merely to gratify the immediate interests of the United
States and Nato in our country. In order to understand, it is necessary
to take into consideration their global aspirations. Besides certain
regions which have a vital importance in and of themselves, because of
their significant natural resources, whatever Nato and the United States
are doing is always a function of their global interests.
First of all, they want to destroy any will to independence and
resistance to their domination of the entire world. Secondly, they want
to send the message that "No country at all is allowed to invoke
principles; it must only respect the way the United States sees things.
Thirdly, Nato is thus drawing closer to the borders of Russia and
China. Washington is working toward breaking them up while planting the
seeds of separatism and manipulating Islamic fundamentalism. On the one
hand, they are deceiving the Muslims in making them believe that they
are their friends.
All of this while they are massacring people in Irak and Palestine.
Jovanovic: Exactly! And on the other hand, they are looking for a way
to control mineral and energy resources in the same way they want to
control the new markets which are opening up to the east of our
country: the Caucasus, the Middle East... Having established their
control over western Europe, the United States now wants to control all
the governments of Eurasia. That is the decisive global factor
involved.
In having resisted for ten years, we have given other countries time.
Some countries have been awakened to their role with respect to the
situation, but it has not been enough. Without a doubt (there was a
melancholy note in his voice), the burden Yugoslavia had to carry was
too heavy. We have received some support, but not enough, most notably
from countries that we were counting on.
Are you thinking of Russia?
Jovanovic: (He did not reply, but merely nodded his head). Nothing is
forever. Including the present situation in Yugoslavia. I am certain
that, just as certain people who voted for the DOS are going to regret
it, certain European countries will regret not having supported
Yugoslavia more and they have come to that realization too late.
(Smiling again) An old Serbian song says: "The bear is dancing on your
uncle's doorstep. And now, he's coming to your house!" In other
words: You haven't budged, but you will regret it. Everybody has
underestimated these events and they have not seen the risk that they
have taken by not reacting.
And from your point of view, do you think you've made some mistakes?
Jovanovic: Yes. I don't want to evade any of our responsibilities. We
did not realistically evaluate the domestic and international
situations. We did not take into consideration the negative factors.
For example?
Jovanovic: Domesticly, we did not realistically consider the sentiments
of the people. We should have paid closer attention to the effects of
the deprivations which the people were subjected to after ten years of
sanctions. The people resisted aggression; they resisted sanctions, but
their living conditions were really degraded beyond any reasonable
point. And with the war on top of it all!
Secondly, after the aggression, we put a great deal of effort into
reconstructing the country. Schools, hospitals, roads, bridges... This
demanded a lot of capital and we had to levy an assessment on salaries
and pensions. The reconstruction was important for the future of the
country, but it did not directly improve the quality of life. We should
have been more realistic as far as investments were concerned, and
adopted further measures to improving the living condition of the
people.
Thirdly, we did not succeed in controlling commerce. We gave too much
latitude to greedy people who stockpiled merchandise, like oil and
sugar, which resulted in prices increases before the market was
resupplied. People profited from the situation to stockpile and
speculate. They sometimes sold items at two or three times their cost!
Imagine the fortunes they accumulated!
There is a cement factory in my region called Paracim. It's a very
important product because there was a lot of reconstruction to do after
the bombardment. During an election rally, a woman came up to me: "Mr.
Minister, why do you let these people charge 13 deutschemarks for a sack
of cement when it only costs 3.5 deutschemarks when it leaves the
factory?" The director of the factory was standing right next to me, so
I turned to him, and he said: "I am only responsible for the
production. I can't control commerce." I talked about this situation
with my colleagues from the economics department. But too late.
Many have criticized your government as well as your party for the fact
that while the great majority of people were living under conditions of
extreme difficulty, fantastic fortunes were also being made. Some
people lived lives of luxury and privilege.
Jovanovic: Some people profited from their position in order to
illegally and immorally enrich themselves. Now we are suffering the
consequences. But they represent a minority. The great majority of our
socialists are honest people who struggle for social justice, education
and health-care for all.
Why didn't you fight more vigorously against this phenomenon? Because
what you are describing is not a recent development.
Jovanovic: The forces at the heart of my party were not inclined to
undertake this struggle. But now, we are going to have to get rid of
these profiteers. Efficiently and pitilessly.
At all levels?
At all levels.
Many people think that Milosevic would have done better to recognize
Kostunica's victory immediately.
Jovanovic: I don't know if Kostunica had 51%, 50% of the vote or
somewhat less, and now I don't care. Anyway one looks at it, it is
clear that he had a 10% lead over Milosevic and that he was going to
win. On the other hand, there is a legal process that must be
respected. They should have verified that he really got 50% or if a
second round was necessary.
In fact, isn't the DOS victory the result of a number of factors?
Jovanovic: Absolutely. The principal-for which we are to blame, and I
myself am to blame-is that we severely misjudged the real situation.
Even though I had achieved good results with my constituency in
Pomoravije, winning three districts out of six. Maybe four after
verification.
In fact, the SPS is holding on to its electorate.
Jovanovic: Yes, but this is what is new. Washington has succeeded in
making the opposition DOS credible. Faced with this great international
campaign, financed by millions of dollars, we can be satisfied to have
succeeded in conserving the SPS's force. Too bad that we did not
succeed in enlarging our base. That will be our task in the future.
Translated by Milo Yelesiyevich
---
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Goran Svilanovic, l'uomo che ha invitato il Tribunale dell'Aia a
Belgrado
-> INTERVISTA ALL'EX MINISTRO DEGLI ESTERI DELLA RFJ
Zivadin Jovanovic, 17/10/2000
Versione in inglese; l'intervista in lingua originale francese e'
leggibile su:
http://www.egroups.com/message/crj-mailinglist/532
(Precedenti interviste ad es. su:
http://www.egroups.com/message/crj-mailinglist/384
http://www.egroups.com/message/crj-mailinglist/362)
---
The URL for this article is http://emperors-clothes.com/news/goran.htm
www.tenc.net
[Emperor's Clothes]
Who is Goran Svilanovic?
The Man Who Invited The War Crimes Tribunal to Belgrade
by Jared Israel (11-7-2000)
Goran Svilanovic became Foreign Minister of Yugoslavia last weekend.
Exactly how Svilanovic achieved this post without a
vote of the Yugoslav Parliament is a mystery, but in his newly acquired
post, Svilanovic just announced, with the apparent
approval of Vojislav Kostunica, who has taken the post of President,
that the International Criminal Tribunal for the Former
Yugoslavia (the 'War Crimes Tribunal') will establish an office in
Belgrade and that 'his' government will fully cooperate in
hunting down 'war criminals.'
This represents a reversal of Yugoslav policy. That policy was
established by a government with a majority of seats in the
Federal Parliament. It does not appear that Parliament has discussed
this change; it has simply been announced.
Goran Svilanovic is Chairperson of the miniscule Serbian Citizens'
Alliance party (GSS). He ascended to that position in
August, 1999. The GSS has had the warmest relations with Washington. Its
previous chair, Vesna Pesic, was a founder of the
Washington-funded group, 'Women in Black,' which simulated the
appearance of a peace movement while actively
discouraging resistance to the Washington/Bonn assault on Yugoslavia.
Pesic is widely despised in Yugoslavia as a traitor.
Another former GSS leader (he is now with the minute Social Democratic
Union) Zarko Korac, a Belgrade psych professor,
has appeared in Western mass media as an expert witness, arguing his pet
theory, that the Yugoslav wars of secession were
caused by Serbian aggression stemming from paranoia, the much acclaimed
'victim mentality.'
Mr. Svilanovic met several times with US Special Envoy to the Balkans,
Robert Gelbard; for instance on August 4, 1999.
('Middle East News Items,' August 10, 1999 )
On Nov. 3. 1999 Svilanovic and other opposition leaders met in
Washington with Madeline Albright who promised them more
money and other support and praised their courage, etc. Following is the
text of Svilanovic's statement made at that time, from
Washington, D.C.:
Text of Svilanovic's statement, broadcast on Radio B2-92, Belgrade,
1600 gmt 4 Nov 99:
"Announcer: The chairman of the Serbian Civic Alliance GSS - member
of the Alliance for Change , Goran Svilanovic,
has joined his party's news conference from Washington by phone and
said that the main achievement of meetings in
Washington is the announcement that a joint working group of the US,
the EU [European Union] and the Serbian
opposition representatives will be set up.
"Svilanovic: They see this working group here as a trilateral
commission. The US has publicly said that it wishes, in
conjunction with the EU, to establish a committee which would
cooperate with a democratic Serbia in the process of
democratic reforms in the country. The idea that the EU and the USA
want and wish to work together and to define a
joint policy regarding Serbia is, as far as I am concerned, the main
achievement of all these meetings."
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[Emperor's Clothes]
---
Published this 17th of October in Solidaire - Belgium
ZIVADIN JOVANOVIC - INTERVIEW
AN EXCLUSIVE INTERVIEW WITH ZIVADIN JOVANOVIC, YUGOSLAV MINISTER OF
FOREIGN
AFFAIRS
"For every dollar that the West "gives" to Yugoslavia, it must have ten
in
return!"
Last week, Solidaire interviewed two Otpor activists, the anti-Milosevic
student movement. Today, it is Zivadin Jovanovic, Yugoslav Foreign
Affairs
Minister, and also one of the most important leaders in Milosevic's SPS
party. This party, having held onto its share of the electorate,
remains
the most important political party in the country. In these troubled
days,
hundreds of international journalists have sought to interview a
socialist
leader. The honor went to Solidaire's special correspondent.
MICHEL COLLON
Tuesday, October 11, 11:30 a.m. I entered the grand oval office of
Zivadin
Jovanovic, Minister of Foreign Affairs. It is probably one of the last
times that he will be found here. Some people say that it's "the end of
a
reign." "An eclips before a likely return," answer those who emphasize
the
fact that with 40% of the electorate (a fixed number), the SPS
(Milosevic's
socialist party) remains the most important party in the country, while
the
present DOS coalition is quite fragile: 18 parties whose programs
contradict one another, and whose electoral promises will be impossible
to
fulfil. Jovanovic, who is quite jovial and quick to smile, also has a
number of questions to ask himself. The impassioned interview lasted
three
hours.
How are you?
Jovanovic: I'm surviving! In spite of a very unpleasant visit paid to
my
this morning by a troika from the DOS, who came to try to force me to
step
down. Claiming to be "from President Kostunica," they are going
everywhere
putting pressure on people who have legal mandates in order to force
them to
leave. I responded that Mr. Kostunica had just sworn allegiance to the
Constitution and, after that, I called to their attention that it is not
the
president but the Prime Minister who names ministers. In public, they
claim
to respect the law and the normal functioning of institutions, but in
reality, they are doing everything in their power to destroy them! They
are
trying to create chaos.
The DOS declares that it is "the workers who are taking control of
factories."
Jovanovic: But when this country practiced "self-management of
companies by
workers," the said that it was a form of Communist dictatorship. In
reality, today, it is Zoran Djindjic, the executive head of DOS
headquarters
and I might add its true master (Editor's note: Djindjic is a
politician
from the right who is extremely unpopular for having supported Nato),
who is
in a hurry to seize everything. They are stampeding like hungry
jackals.
These politicians are not the people. They want to seize power of
everything right away in order to start selling off the country.
One could see on television the Customs Chief chased out of his office
and
replaced, under the threat of arms by a certain "Captian Dragan," who is
the
leader of a Serbian militia that was active during the war in Croatia.
This
was a scene that shook public opinion.
Jovanovic: The man whom Djindjic placed as Customs Chief had been in
charge
of customs before. He was fired because he had a police record. Now,
he
comes back with armed supporters and takes his old job back! Is this a
"spontaneous movement that arose from the masses?" People were so
infuriated that the DOS realized that it was an illegal act and that
they
would have to nominate a new director. On the basis of what law? It is
not
within their power to do so because the nomination of a new director is
within the jurisdiction the current government, which is still in
office.
Little by little, the people are going to understand. Even the DOS.
There
are honest people who disapprove. But they lost, and without any
influence.
President Kostunica whose reputation is impeccable, ought to be
concerned
about this. In Parliament, he took an oath of loyalty to the
Constitution.
These people are scoffing at it now.
But for the moment, most of the population is very happy about the
"change."
Jovanovic: They will understand what took place when they find
themselves
without a job, when they see the stores filled with Western products
that
they will be impossible for them to buy, when they submit to a system
where
they can be arbitrarily deprived of jobs, and when they have to pay
enormous
sums of money for education and health care. That's when they'll
understand.
I know that our stores are not very impressive. There are few German,
French or English products. But most of the people can buy whatever
they
need, even modern domestic appliances. It will be a rude awakening.
People
cannot dream very long about miraculous solutions.
The West promises to provide Yugoslavia with financial aid.
Jovanovic: A little money will come from Europe, and the DOS will
present
it as "aid from friendly countries." In reality, it will be a down
payment
on the purchase of our entire country. For every dollar received, we
will
be obliged to pay back ten!
In fact, dollars have already found their way into Yugoslavia.
Jovanovic: Yes, the United States publicly acknowledged having spent
$77.2
million dollars in order to help the opposition overturn the Yugoslav
government. And on September 25, the U.S. Congress voted a new credit
of
$105 million dollars.
Have you lodged a protest with the UN against this interference in
elections?
Jovanovic: Of course. This destabilization of our country was
organized
first in Budapest, with American offices established in Sofia, Skoplje
and
elsewhere, and composed of CIA agents. The Vienna Accords forbid
establishing centers in one country that are hostile to another. Look
at
what's happening today. The American ambassador to Budapest,
Montgomery, is
coming to Yugoslavia to pay a visit to his subordinates at the DOS!
But the United States and Great Britain, who control the UN, have denied
all
evidence of this. Other countries understand what's happening here, but
we
can't even get a debate.
The United States has spent considerable sums of money for the DOS
electoral
campaign.
Jovanovic: Yes. And how would they react if this sort of thing was
done in
the United States? It reminds me of a joke that's told here: a
villager
sees a priest eating a huge serving of roast beef in the middle of a
religious fast. "But you told us that fasting was a one of God's
commandments!" says the villager. The priest replies: "You're supposed
to
obey my instructions, but you're not supposed to act the way I do!"
In short, "do as I say, not as I do."
Jovanovic: (Laughing) Yes! That's exactly the case with the United
States!
What they permit themselves to do, they forbid to others. Whenever they
speak of "democracy," it's merely a slogan they advance in order to
dominate
the world. Another example: they want to impose an International War
Crimes tribunal in order to put us on trial. But they themselves refuse
to
accept a universal war crimes tribunal, which would put them on trial
for
all of the war crimes they committed against various sovereign states.
They
know all too well that they would be convicted for what they have done
in
Panama, Haiti and elsewhere!
In 1995, in the Assembly General of the United Nations, they voted
against a
resolution which forbade intervention in the domestic affairs,
particularly
electoral, of other countries. This resolution was voted in despite
American opposition, so they ought to follow the rules of the democratic
majority! "Two weights, two measures," that's the key to American-style
"democracy."
Is Yugoslavia lone targeted, or does this announce other offensives by
the
United States and Nato?
Jovanovic: It is not merely the problem of one country in a strategic
region. They are going to make a terrific effort because if Yugoslav
resistance lasted much longer, it would have become a dangerous
example. We
were in the process of acquiring growing support from the Third World.
Is Russia the next step?
Jovanovic: If so much energy has been concentrated against Yugoslavia,
then
it is not merely to gratify the immediate interests of the United States
and
Nato in our country. In order to understand, it is necessary to take
into
consideration their global aspirations. Besides certain regions which
have
a vital importance in and of themselves, because of their significant
natural resources, whatever Nato and the United States are doing is
always a
function of their global interests.
First of all, they want to destroy any will to independence and
resistance
to their domination of the entire world. Secondly, they want to send
the
message that "No country at all is allowed to invoke principles; it must
only respect the way the United States sees things. Thirdly, Nato is
thus
drawing closer to the borders of Russia and China. Washington is
working
toward breaking them up while planting the seeds of separatism and
manipulating Islamic fundamentalism. On the one hand, they are
deceiving
the Muslims in making them believe that they are their friends.
All of this while they are massacring people in Irak and Palestine.
Jovanovic: Exactly! And on the other hand, they are looking for a way
to
control mineral and energy resources in the same way they want to
control
the new markets which are opening up to the east of our country: the
Caucasus, the Middle East... Having established their control over
western
Europe, the United States now wants to control all the governments of
Eurasia. That is the decisive global factor involved.
In having resisted for ten years, we have given other countries time.
Some
countries have been awakened to their role with respect to the
situation,
but it has not been enough. Without a doubt (there was a melancholy
note in
his voice), the burden Yugoslavia had to carry was too heavy. We have
received some support, but not enough, most notably from countries that
we
were counting on.
Are you thinking of Russia?
Jovanovic: (He did not reply, but merely nodded his head). Nothing is
forever. Including the present situation in Yugoslavia. I am certain
that,
just as certain people who voted for the DOS are going to regret it,
certain
European countries will regret not having supported Yugoslavia more and
they
have come to that realization too late.
(Smiling again) An old Serbian song says: "The bear is dancing on your
uncle's doorstep. And now, he's coming to your house!" In other words:
You haven't budged, but you will regret it. Everybody has
underestimated
these events and they have not seen the risk that they have taken by not
reacting.
And from your point of view, do you think you've made some mistakes?
Jovanovic: Yes. I don't want to evade any of our responsibilities. We
did
not realistically evaluate the domestic and international situations.
We
did not take into consideration the negative factors.
For example?
Jovanovic: Domesticly, we did not realistically consider the sentiments
of
the people. We should have paid closer attention to the effects of the
deprivations which the people were subjected to after ten years of
sanctions. The people resisted aggression; they resisted sanctions, but
their living conditions were really degraded beyond any reasonable
point.
And with the war on top of it all!
Secondly, after the aggression, we put a great deal of effort into
reconstructing the country. Schools, hospitals, roads, bridges... This
demanded a lot of capital and we had to levy an assessment on salaries
and
pensions. The reconstruction was important for the future of the
country,
but it did not directly improve the quality of life. We should have
been
more realistic as far as investments were concerned, and adopted further
measures to improving the living condition of the people.
Thirdly, we did not succeed in controlling commerce. We gave too much
latitude to greedy people who stockpiled merchandise, like oil and
sugar,
which resulted in prices increases before the market was resupplied.
People
profited from the situation to stockpile and speculate. They sometimes
sold
items at two or three times their cost! Imagine the fortunes they
accumulated!
There is a cement factory in my region called Paracim. It's a very
important product because there was a lot of reconstruction to do after
the
bombardment. During an election rally, a woman came up to me: "Mr.
Minister, why do you let these people charge 13 deutschemarks for a sack
of
cement when it only costs 3.5 deutschemarks when it leaves the factory?"
The director of the factory was standing right next to me, so I turned
to
him, and he said: "I am only responsible for the production. I can't
control commerce." I talked about this situation with my colleagues
from
the economics department. But too late.
Many have criticized your government as well as your party for the fact
that
while the great majority of people were living under conditions of
extreme
difficulty, fantastic fortunes were also being made. Some people lived
lives of luxury and privilege.
Jovanovic: Some people profited from their position in order to
illegally
and immorally enrich themselves. Now we are suffering the consequences.
But they represent a minority. The great majority of our socialists are
honest people who struggle for social justice, education and health-care
for
all.
Why didn't you fight more vigorously against this phenomenon? Because
what
you are describing is not a recent development.
Jovanovic: The forces at the heart of my party were not inclined to
undertake this struggle. But now, we are going to have to get rid of
these
profiteers. Efficiently and pitilessly.
At all levels?
At all levels.
Many people think that Milosevic would have done better to recognize
Kostunica's victory immediately.
Jovanovic: I don't know if Kostunica had 51%, 50% of the vote or
somewhat
less, and now I don't care. Anyway one looks at it, it is clear that he
had
a 10% lead over Milosevic and that he was going to win. On the other
hand,
there is a legal process that must be respected. They should have
verified
that he really got 50% or if a second round was necessary.
In fact, isn't the DOS victory the result of a number of factors?
Jovanovic: Absolutely. The principal-for which we are to blame, and I
myself am to blame-is that we severely misjudged the real situation.
Even
though I had achieved good results with my constituency in Pomoravije,
winning three districts out of six. Maybe four after verification.
In fact, the SPS is holding on to its electorate.
Jovanovic: Yes, but this is what is new. Washington has succeeded in
making the opposition DOS credible. Faced with this great international
campaign, financed by millions of dollars, we can be satisfied to have
succeeded in conserving the SPS's force. Too bad that we did not
succeed in
enlarging our base. That will be our task in the future.
Translated by Milo Yelesiyevich
Michel Collon
ZIVADIN JOVANOVIC - INTERVIEWAN EXCLUSIVE INTERVIEW WITH ZIVADIN
JOVANOVIC, YUGOSLAV MINISTER OF FOREIGN
AFFAIRS
"For every dollar that the West "gives" to Yugoslavia, it must have ten
in return!"
Last week, Solidaire interviewed two Otpor activists, the anti-Milosevic
student movement. Today, it is Zivadin Jovanovic, Yugoslav Foreign
Affairs Minister, and also one of the most important leaders in
Milosevic's SPS party. This party, having held onto its share of the
electorate, remains the most important political party in the country.
In these troubled days, hundreds of international journalists have
sought to interview a socialist leader. The honor went to Solidaire's
special correspondent.
MICHEL COLLON
Tuesday, October 11, 11:30 a.m. I entered the grand oval office of
Zivadin Jovanovic, Minister of Foreign Affairs. It is probably one of
the last times that he will be found here. Some people say that it's
"the end of a reign." "An eclips before a likely return," answer those
who emphasize the fact that with 40% of the electorate (a fixed number),
the SPS (Milosevic's socialist party) remains the most important party
in the country, while the present DOS coalition is quite fragile: 18
parties whose programs contradict one another, and whose electoral
promises will be impossible to fulfil. Jovanovic, who is quite jovial
and quick to smile, also has a number of questions to ask himself. The
impassioned interview lasted three hours.
How are you?
Jovanovic: I'm surviving! In spite of a very unpleasant visit paid to
my this morning by a troika from the DOS, who came to try to force me to
step down. Claiming to be "from President Kostunica," they are going
everywhere putting pressure on people who have legal mandates in order
to force them to leave. I responded that Mr. Kostunica had just sworn
allegiance to the Constitution and, after that, I called to their
attention that it is not the president but the Prime Minister who names
ministers. In public, they claim to respect the law and the normal
functioning of institutions, but in reality, they are doing everything
in their power to destroy them! They are trying to create chaos.
The DOS declares that it is "the workers who are taking control of
factories."
Jovanovic: But when this country practiced "self-management of
companies by workers," the said that it was a form of Communist
dictatorship. In reality, today, it is Zoran Djindjic, the executive
head of DOS headquarters and I might add its true master (Editor's
note: Djindjic is a politician from the right who is extremely
unpopular for having supported Nato), who is in a hurry to seize
everything. They are stampeding like hungry jackals. These politicians
are not the people. They want to seize power of everything right away
in order to start selling off the country.
One could see on television the Customs Chief chased out of his office
and replaced, under the threat of arms by a certain "Captian Dragan,"
who is the leader of a Serbian militia that was active during the war in
Croatia. This was a scene that shook public opinion.
Jovanovic: The man whom Djindjic placed as Customs Chief had been in
charge of customs before. He was fired because he had a police record.
Now, he comes back with armed supporters and takes his old job back! Is
this a "spontaneous movement that arose from the masses?" People were
so infuriated that the DOS realized that it was an illegal act and that
they would have to nominate a new director. On the basis of what law?
It is not within their power to do so because the nomination of a new
director is within the jurisdiction the current government, which is
still in office.
Little by little, the people are going to understand. Even the DOS.
There are honest people who disapprove. But they lost, and without any
influence. President Kostunica whose reputation is impeccable, ought to
be concerned about this. In Parliament, he took an oath of loyalty to
the Constitution. These people are scoffing at it now.
But for the moment, most of the population is very happy about the
"change."
Jovanovic: They will understand what took place when they find
themselves without a job, when they see the stores filled with Western
products that they will be impossible for them to buy, when they submit
to a system where they can be arbitrarily deprived of jobs, and when
they have to pay enormous sums of money for education and health care.
That's when they'll understand.
I know that our stores are not very impressive. There are few German,
French or English products. But most of the people can buy whatever
they need, even modern domestic appliances. It will be a rude
awakening. People cannot dream very long about miraculous solutions.
The West promises to provide Yugoslavia with financial aid.
Jovanovic: A little money will come from Europe, and the DOS will
present it as "aid from friendly countries." In reality, it will be a
down payment on the purchase of our entire country. For every dollar
received, we will be obliged to pay back ten!
In fact, dollars have already found their way into Yugoslavia.
Jovanovic: Yes, the United States publicly acknowledged having spent
$77.2 million dollars in order to help the opposition overturn the
Yugoslav government. And on September 25, the U.S. Congress voted a new
credit of $105 million dollars.
Have you lodged a protest with the UN against this interference in
elections?
Jovanovic: Of course. This destabilization of our country was
organized first in Budapest, with American offices established in Sofia,
Skoplje and elsewhere, and composed of CIA agents. The Vienna Accords
forbid establishing centers in one country that are hostile to another.
Look at what's happening today. The American ambassador to Budapest,
Montgomery, is coming to Yugoslavia to pay a visit to his subordinates
at the DOS!
But the United States and Great Britain, who control the UN, have denied
all evidence of this. Other countries understand what's happening here,
but we can't even get a debate.
The United States has spent considerable sums of money for the DOS
electoral campaign.
Jovanovic: Yes. And how would they react if this sort of thing was
done in the United States? It reminds me of a joke that's told here: a
villager sees a priest eating a huge serving of roast beef in the middle
of a religious fast. "But you told us that fasting was a one of God's
commandments!" says the villager. The priest replies: "You're supposed
to obey my instructions, but you're not supposed to act the way I do!"
In short, "do as I say, not as I do."
Jovanovic: (Laughing) Yes! That's exactly the case with the United
States! What they permit themselves to do, they forbid to others.
Whenever they speak of "democracy," it's merely a slogan they advance in
order to dominate the world. Another example: they want to impose an
International War Crimes tribunal in order to put us on trial. But they
themselves refuse to accept a universal war crimes tribunal, which would
put them on trial for all of the war crimes they committed against
various sovereign states. They know all too well that they would be
convicted for what they have done in Panama, Haiti and elsewhere!
In 1995, in the Assembly General of the United Nations, they voted
against a resolution which forbade intervention in the domestic affairs,
particularly electoral, of other countries. This resolution was voted
in despite American opposition, so they ought to follow the rules of the
democratic majority! "Two weights, two measures," that's the key to
American-style "democracy."
Is Yugoslavia lone targeted, or does this announce other offensives by
the United States and Nato?
Jovanovic: It is not merely the problem of one country in a strategic
region. They are going to make a terrific effort because if Yugoslav
resistance lasted much longer, it would have become a dangerous
example. We were in the process of acquiring growing support from the
Third World.
Is Russia the next step?
Jovanovic: If so much energy has been concentrated against Yugoslavia,
then it is not merely to gratify the immediate interests of the United
States and Nato in our country. In order to understand, it is necessary
to take into consideration their global aspirations. Besides certain
regions which have a vital importance in and of themselves, because of
their significant natural resources, whatever Nato and the United States
are doing is always a function of their global interests.
First of all, they want to destroy any will to independence and
resistance to their domination of the entire world. Secondly, they want
to send the message that "No country at all is allowed to invoke
principles; it must only respect the way the United States sees things.
Thirdly, Nato is thus drawing closer to the borders of Russia and
China. Washington is working toward breaking them up while planting the
seeds of separatism and manipulating Islamic fundamentalism. On the one
hand, they are deceiving the Muslims in making them believe that they
are their friends.
All of this while they are massacring people in Irak and Palestine.
Jovanovic: Exactly! And on the other hand, they are looking for a way
to control mineral and energy resources in the same way they want to
control the new markets which are opening up to the east of our
country: the Caucasus, the Middle East... Having established their
control over western Europe, the United States now wants to control all
the governments of Eurasia. That is the decisive global factor
involved.
In having resisted for ten years, we have given other countries time.
Some countries have been awakened to their role with respect to the
situation, but it has not been enough. Without a doubt (there was a
melancholy note in his voice), the burden Yugoslavia had to carry was
too heavy. We have received some support, but not enough, most notably
from countries that we were counting on.
Are you thinking of Russia?
Jovanovic: (He did not reply, but merely nodded his head). Nothing is
forever. Including the present situation in Yugoslavia. I am certain
that, just as certain people who voted for the DOS are going to regret
it, certain European countries will regret not having supported
Yugoslavia more and they have come to that realization too late.
(Smiling again) An old Serbian song says: "The bear is dancing on your
uncle's doorstep. And now, he's coming to your house!" In other
words: You haven't budged, but you will regret it. Everybody has
underestimated these events and they have not seen the risk that they
have taken by not reacting.
And from your point of view, do you think you've made some mistakes?
Jovanovic: Yes. I don't want to evade any of our responsibilities. We
did not realistically evaluate the domestic and international
situations. We did not take into consideration the negative factors.
For example?
Jovanovic: Domesticly, we did not realistically consider the sentiments
of the people. We should have paid closer attention to the effects of
the deprivations which the people were subjected to after ten years of
sanctions. The people resisted aggression; they resisted sanctions, but
their living conditions were really degraded beyond any reasonable
point. And with the war on top of it all!
Secondly, after the aggression, we put a great deal of effort into
reconstructing the country. Schools, hospitals, roads, bridges... This
demanded a lot of capital and we had to levy an assessment on salaries
and pensions. The reconstruction was important for the future of the
country, but it did not directly improve the quality of life. We should
have been more realistic as far as investments were concerned, and
adopted further measures to improving the living condition of the
people.
Thirdly, we did not succeed in controlling commerce. We gave too much
latitude to greedy people who stockpiled merchandise, like oil and
sugar, which resulted in prices increases before the market was
resupplied. People profited from the situation to stockpile and
speculate. They sometimes sold items at two or three times their cost!
Imagine the fortunes they accumulated!
There is a cement factory in my region called Paracim. It's a very
important product because there was a lot of reconstruction to do after
the bombardment. During an election rally, a woman came up to me: "Mr.
Minister, why do you let these people charge 13 deutschemarks for a sack
of cement when it only costs 3.5 deutschemarks when it leaves the
factory?" The director of the factory was standing right next to me, so
I turned to him, and he said: "I am only responsible for the
production. I can't control commerce." I talked about this situation
with my colleagues from the economics department. But too late.
Many have criticized your government as well as your party for the fact
that while the great majority of people were living under conditions of
extreme difficulty, fantastic fortunes were also being made. Some
people lived lives of luxury and privilege.
Jovanovic: Some people profited from their position in order to
illegally and immorally enrich themselves. Now we are suffering the
consequences. But they represent a minority. The great majority of our
socialists are honest people who struggle for social justice, education
and health-care for all.
Why didn't you fight more vigorously against this phenomenon? Because
what you are describing is not a recent development.
Jovanovic: The forces at the heart of my party were not inclined to
undertake this struggle. But now, we are going to have to get rid of
these profiteers. Efficiently and pitilessly.
At all levels?
At all levels.
Many people think that Milosevic would have done better to recognize
Kostunica's victory immediately.
Jovanovic: I don't know if Kostunica had 51%, 50% of the vote or
somewhat less, and now I don't care. Anyway one looks at it, it is
clear that he had a 10% lead over Milosevic and that he was going to
win. On the other hand, there is a legal process that must be
respected. They should have verified that he really got 50% or if a
second round was necessary.
In fact, isn't the DOS victory the result of a number of factors?
Jovanovic: Absolutely. The principal-for which we are to blame, and I
myself am to blame-is that we severely misjudged the real situation.
Even though I had achieved good results with my constituency in
Pomoravije, winning three districts out of six. Maybe four after
verification.
In fact, the SPS is holding on to its electorate.
Jovanovic: Yes, but this is what is new. Washington has succeeded in
making the opposition DOS credible. Faced with this great international
campaign, financed by millions of dollars, we can be satisfied to have
succeeded in conserving the SPS's force. Too bad that we did not
succeed in enlarging our base. That will be our task in the future.
Translated by Milo Yelesiyevich
---
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